"I'm sorry,truly!"
Disclaimer: For those of you who are my friends from pixlbit, twitter, and face book this does not apply to you. You guys are generally awesome and make me feel at home and welcome even if our opinions and beliefs do not always synch up.
It’s a crying shame that not every place on the internet is so “friendly”. After reading some craziness and tumblr I responded to it and lost a lot of faith in humanity while doing so.
Yes, this is about all that pervasive “Hawkeye initiative stuff“ again! Playful satire to some and political agenda to others! I am sorry, truly. Just let me purge this from my system as you get to delight in my lucid late night madness!
"Stop it. Please,don't make me "hate" feminism due to your bad example. I'm already a skeptic as it is!"
My reply
"So because I’m white and male I cannot have an opinion? Careful, that’s like a Nazi telling a Jewish person "Get in line and shut up!" When oppressing any group the first step is silencing them and dismissing the importance of their point of view. It’s the equivalent of me telling a woman to close her trap and make me a sandwich.
Look, not all white males have “privilege". For example, I’m a pedestrian because I’m too poor to own a car, I’m on disability, and my income is roughly $700.00 monthly. (Aka,We’re all unique individuals.)
Though not in every instance, it’s often a “privileged white female" from a college or university screaming at other people to check their own privilege.
Stop making snap assumptions about people based on their gender and skin color,ladies. If you insist on thinking of yourself as “educated" don’t stoop to the mob mentality of a hate group."
~Me
"Imagine Morgan Freeman is reading this out loud for extra classy factor!"
I know regardless of how well I represent this argument, someone is going to try their best to poke holes into it. At the very best I may learn something new from someone who replies because of this but I expect many more angry comments that use broad sweeping generalizations.
To get something right off the bat right away I am NOT an MRA. If labeling me as such makes you feel good and tingly inside go ahead! However, it still will not magically become a true fact just because you believe in it. Don’t get me wrong. I think men have a right to fight for their freedoms just like any other group of people. However, as an egalitarian it’s my goal to build up humanity as a whole without favoring one particular fringe group over the others. (For that reason I’m not a feminist either. Yes, feminist claim to fight for equality for both genders yet it irks me they use a word that totally excludes one of them. There’s something very insincere about that.)
Let me cut straight to the issue. I do have a serious problem with the Hawkeye initiative. Not because the parody art I’ve seen is an utter waste of time (Got a laugh out of many of them. Oh Hawkie, you so fine you blow my mind, hey Hawkie! Clap! Clap! Clap!) but because it’s a veiled attempt into shaming artists into changing the way they draw based on the ideals of one group of very vocal people.
I know someone is going to come at me talking about sexism, broken spines, ass shots, boob shots, and how comic books really need to change. I will not argue with that. However, I think comic books can change without excluding anyone. If there’s a group of people wanting to portray women in a sexy and exaggerated way by all means, let them do so! If you do not like it, don’t buy those books and support the books that portray women in a way you do approve of.
Furthermore, consider getting into comic books yourself. No, I don’t mean simply doing parody doodles from the side lines safely outside the nerd zone within your own safe bubble where everyone agrees with you. I mean jumping into the fray to make your own comic book! Yes, it’ll be hard work. Yes, it may take awhile to get it published. However, if you work diligently and improve over time you will get the right kind of attention!
Anyway, I want to give my viewpoints on what has already been argued. I’ve broken down the points below.
Women are drawn to be sexy, men are drawn to be strong!
Whenever a poor hapless nerd tries to defend his stance by saying “Men are objectified and drawn out of proportion too!” the inevitable reply will be “Yeah, but men are drawn to be power fantasies where women are drawn to be sexual fantasies!” Part of that later response rings true. Be that as it may, what defines “attractiveness” for each gender varies.
For men, strength, influential power, and wealth equates to sexuality. Yes, I can arch my back and shake my ass as a dude while wearing spandex but in truth the main reaction I will get is being laughed at. This is because men are held to a different set of rules than women are. (Just to be clear, this relates to straight men. The divine favors the gay man. He can be more cheeky and saucy while getting away with it!)
Assuming I started to work out in the gym and assuming I started to drive around in a nice car, women would pay more attention to me. Oh, you can try to deny it of course. You can say “I’m not into muscle heads” or “Dudes with cars like that are going through a midlife crisis!”. Yet if you’re a heterosexual woman deep down you will feel a draw to the kind of man I just described. Aka, women are attracted to Bruce Wayne. He’s physically fit, he’s rich, he’s smart, he’s handsome, and he’s somewhat mysterious. If Batman did feminine sexy poses all the time while smirking he would be a joke character. For male characters in comics, standing up tall, crouching in the shadows, or flexing their arm muscles is the equivalent of the boob shot or the ass shot. Their epic posturing proves that they can easily fulfill the roles of protectors, lovers,conquerors,laborers, and providers.
So why then does Selena Kyle get away with being the sexy snark? For one thing, Selena Kyle always has been sexually promiscuous and a bit of a snark. Two, those “exaggerated poses” actually look graceful, acrobatic, and alluring when she does them because her body is that of a woman’s.
Again, the rules for what is attractive varies between each gender and yes, both men and women are objectified in comic books and both men and women have exaggerated physiques in comics that usually would not hold up in real life. Bruce’s bones would break underneath the weight of his muscle mass and Selena’s back would have to be double jointed to pull off some of Cat woman’s hijinks. No one is arguing this, really. The problem is “The Hawkeye Initiative” is only trying to change how women are portrayed as opposed to trying to change how men are portrayed too.
This art sucks, it’s not realistic!
While I will admit “classic comic books” were more believable when it came to physical anatomy, I don’t think they have EVER strived for photo-realism. Comic books are pure fantasy and to hold them up under the scrutiny of a critical realist lens misses the whole damned point. Also, there are many artists in this field so luckily you will find something that fits your personal tastes eventually! By the way, opinions are subjective! What you loath another person might love. Just food for thought, aye?
All comics have pinup covers and pander!
I’m not going to say you are a “fake nerd” if you believe Marvel & DC super-hero stories with “hawt vixens” on the covers are the only comic books out there. However, I will call you out for being naïve.
Yes, many of the mainstream comics do in fact “pander”. However, you have choices. Ever heard about Sandman? Books of magic? Preacher? Artesia? Astro city? Watchmen? V for vendetta? Dawn? Bone? The Maxx? Elf Quest? Witchblade? The Darkness? While I cannot guarantee each of the examples listed here will jive with your pc sensibilities, they will possibly be a breath of fresh air from what you are used to. A few of these examples do in fact pander here or there but on average they also seem to have much deeper story telling and more original ideas.
I don’t like it, it’s wrong! Censorship and fascism here we come!
You “can” dislike something. No, it doesn’t make it “wrong” by default. Offended by Cat woman’s or Star fire’s promiscuity? Guess what? They’ve always been that way! (I’m talking about comic book continuity, not the Teen Titans cartoon) Insisting characters change to conform with your ideologies is censorship. It’s like saying Huck Finn or Tom Sawyer cannot use the word “nigger” even though at the time and place where those books took place, “nigger” was commonly used. This wasn’t because Mark Twain was racist. Actually, his stories were very anti-racist. However, racism was a big problem in the south so Mark should have the right to put it out there like it was without sugar coating it! Even in real life some women choose to be strippers, porn stars, or simply “sexually liberated” in their day to day activities. What’s next? Telling “real people” how they should act and dress? Get the fuck over yourselves, seriously.
Comic books, a boy’s club?
Look at this filthy man pig smiling away! Subversive misogyny I tell you!
When I was growing up I had many friends who drew just like me and wanted to go into comics. Many of those friends were even more talented than myself but the main factor of commonality amongst all of us is that we were all teenaged guys. I wouldn’t meet a female who wanted to be a cartoonist & comic book artist until I went to college and her name was Julie. (Julie was sweet, smart, and pretty. Never had the courage to express how I truly felt about her. Then again, she was also going out with a friend so I did not want to be a relationship wrecker in the first place.)
I hope we can at least agree that some job occupations draw in more of one gender than the other gender. Comic books are not a male dominated industry because of a “no girls” policy. They’re a male dominated industry because it’s mostly men who want to draw comics.
Fortunately, this has not stopped women from going into the comics field. If you want to sit at that table you most certainly can with the right skill sets and a healthy dose of imagination and creativity. The only person stopping you is you. It’s easier to sit around and bitch about how life is unfair but take it from me, it really doesn’t get you anywhere!
Heterosexual male fantasies are DIGUSTING!
Fair enough. I happen to think yaoi, slash fics, 50 shades of grey, and Twilight are somewhat off putting but I’ll let you wank to yours of you let me wank to mine! If you don’t take my porn away and I will not take your porn away! Fair?
You disagree with us?! MRA scum!
Please refer to the open paragraphs of this blog where I very clearly identify as being an egalitarian, not an MRA. Thank you!
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