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PixlTalk   

PixlTalk Episode 50: Get Off My Lawn!

You damn kids with your rock music and your electronic doodads.

Grab the Metamucil and adjust your Depends, folks: PixlTalk is officially old! Your normal crew 2 Tri-Force (Julian, Rob, and Patrick) decide to celebrate the big 5-0 in style. How? By ranting like old men about the way gaming used to be, dammit! You'll learn that Julian does a terrible old man voice, but Patrick does an amazing one, balancing out the insanity of this episode. Before that, we talk about what we're playing now, with some discussion on Mass Effect 2, Skyward Sword, Kingdoms of Amalur: Reckoning, and Asura's Wrath. So sit back, crank up those hearing aids, put on your rose-tinted glasses, and enjoy!

Next time, we'll be talking about the state of the gaming industry in Japan. Let us know your thoughts on the Japanese development scene in the comments below!

Featured music: The Ink Spots: If I Didn't Care

-Excelsior!


 

Comments

Michael117

01/20/2012 at 04:04 PM

Everybody's old man voices were great. Patrick was spot on, Julian sounded hilariously bad as an old man, and Rob sounded exactly like the creepy merchant from Resident Evil 4. Lol right? Think back, "Hey stranger! Whata-ya buyin? Whata-ya sellin? Come back anytime, ye heh!". Rob was channeling his inner creepy merchant when he did his old man voice lol.

I agree with Julian on the excessive tutorials. Tutorials are necessary in games, but it's easy to let it become handholding and invasive or even disruptive (Jules brought up the Batman detective mode reference). Not long ago I was thinking in the shower (Some people sing in the shower, I think about game design lol) about how to do tutorials differently in sophisticated games. In a classic game like Super Mario a tutorial can be accomplished in a matter of moments because there's only a few mechanics and possibilities in the game They can pause the game, bring up a window, and give you notes to tell you how to jump and run. As sophistication increases and more mechanics are added to a game, teaching a player how to play becomes more intellectual or philosophical in a way, and less A= jump. I think Portal 2 did a perfect job of getting me to learn new mechanics and use them through observation, interpretation, and experimentation.

It's quite a marvel too because take a moment to think about the general mechanics that are implemented in the game, and then the physical properties or principles behind them. Momentum flinging uses gravity, velocity, increasing momentum, and as the difficulty increases you have to fling yourself while observing the environment and using quick timing to establish new portal sets that will keep you airborn until you get to a destination. It's not an easy game with easy concepts and mechanics yet kids and parents alike are capable of playing it together and learning fairly organically. The game just lets me watch and learn from the environment, interpret what I see, and most importantly experiment. It doesn't insult your intelligence, and it expects that the human beings of different ages playing the game will have the creativity, reasoning, and observational skills to understand and go experiment till they get to the end.

Valve employs designers and playtest analysts like Mike Abinder that not only study computer science but also study psychology, and it's for good reason. A "tutorial" is a simple teaching tool that can teach you to jump and crouch, which Portal 2 does as you move around in the beginning of the game. However the more sophisticated the game becomes the more you need a sophisticated design and philosophy as to how players will observe, interpret, and experiement with complex concepts. The learning of mechanics is more hands-on and organic in Portal 2 and as the difficulty increases the player learns and adapts without the game stopping, letting you read a text book, holding your hand, and letting that continue as more mechanics are introduced. We should absolultely give players more credit and challenge them while creating an environment in which they can organically learn the skills necessary to overcome the challenges we design. Everybody learns differently (hands-on, visual, verbal, etc) and a game should include some of each teaching technique, but I think in a video game, especially since it's interactive, the hands-on learning is the most important.

Organic and hands-on learning is more fascinating that anything because it comes naturally to humans, it's how we evolved. We didn't learn to hunt mammoths by opening a text book or waiting for somebody to hold our hands. We observed, interpreted, and experimented. Sometimes we died, sometimes we lived, sometimes it failed, sometimes it succeeded. Even the humans that can be classified as "stupid" or of low intelligence are still, in the grand scale of things and in comparison to other species, capable of extremely clever thought and abstract problem solving. This could be used in game design to challenge players and avoid excessive or ineffective learning techniques or tutorials.

Onto the other ranting, I try to be a green person, but I'm with Julian on the booklets. Since back in the day booklets were always the first part of the new game ritual. Back in the day I could buy the bare bones standard version of any game and it would come with a legit box, artwork, and an instruction booklet that was like 40 pages long and contained story, characters, pictures, description of weapons, vehicles, items, spells, skill trees, in addition to the configuration and credits list. Back in the day I could buy a new game, look at the final 2-4 pages of the book and see who the level designers, testers, audio guys, and everybody was. Nowadays it's all on the disc (to save paper, money, and time) and it's just a quiet lame film-esk scrolling list. It seems like the people who make games don't get to take as much pride in it anymore, it's shifted in favor of the business side and productivity side.

These days you have to pay extra money for collections editions just to get insight into the developer's culture, get some fan service, and feel connected. When I open up Assassins Creed 2 or Modern Warfare 3's standard case I just see an eco case, disc, and a like 11 page manual where there's more siezure warnings than anything else and I feel no connection to the product and culture at all.

My favorite new game ritual of all time was with Halo Reach's collectors edition because it was the best fan service I've ever had from start to finish. When I got the game I spent over an hour looking through all the cool shit Bungie put into the package like the fictional news reports, pictures, documents, and ultimately reading though Dr. Halsey's personal journal where she details her hypothesies and experiements behind her Spartan-II augmentations, her selection process of indoctrination candidates, her conceptualizing and manufacturing of Cortana, and the invasion of Reach all told from her perspective and all the beautiful hand-drawn pictures the Bungie artists put into the journal. Then at the end of Reach instead of just letting a boring text list go by, Bungie had a message to their fans (as they did in all the other Halos) in addition to funny pictures of the people on the development team and personal messages from all of them. I was so happy with Reach's collectors edition that it was no longer a simple product. It became passion, art, and the actual artists themselves that I could connect to and I just wanted to cry. It really meant a great deal to me not only artistically but most of all as being a fan of the universe they had been developing over the past 10 years.

Bungie went all out, connected with fans like me, and let me know that this experience I just had wasn't Microsoft's game. It was Bungie's game, they were proud of it, they hope I enjoyed it, and told me thank you. You don't get that often anymore. These days when I buy my games I often feel like I'm connecting with somebodies bank account and quarterly statement, not their art and imagination. A lot of people I know have played Halo only for the multiplayer and don't have the same connection with the franchise I do. I sometimes have a hard time explaining why Bungie, the Halo IP, novels, universe, and characters mean so much to me, but things like this are about as close as I come to being able to explain it. When I would buy Bungie games I would buy them to connect with people like Jason Jones, Joseph Staten, and Marty O'Donnell. When I buy Id games I want to connect with John Carmack. When I would buy Zeldas as a kid it was because I wanted to connect with Shigeru Miyamoto and his imagination.

Julian Titus Senior Editor

01/21/2012 at 08:49 PM

I remember the first game that I played with an in-game tutorial was Legacy of Kain: Soul Reaver on PSX. I was in awe at the elegant way the game taught me the controls in the context of the story. That was fine in 1999, but things have changed since then.

I think what I want is more control in the options. Going off of my idea in the podcast, when you fire up a game, it should ask you "How comfortable are you with games?". Then you'd select from options like "I don't play many games", "I play games, but I'm not an expert", "I'm an avid gamer that plays a lot", etc. After picking this, you would pick your difficulty level like normal.

Once in the game, the tutorials and tool tips would pop up dynamically based on your selections. If you pick "avid gamer", you would be given control and told to go wild. The only time control hints would pop up would be when you learn a new ability/get a new weapon, or if the game sees that you've been stuck in a room where a specific move needs to be used.

The popular thing for developers to do these days is adjust the difficulty of games on the backend. If you're struggling on an encounter, things get a little easier. I hate that. I don't want to be coddled. A great example of how this can be done poorly is Mortal Kombat. When you get to Shao Khan, he's as cheap and annoying as he was back in the day. But lose to him enough times and he becomes dirt stupid, doing nothing but taunts. So instead of me learning his tricks and rising to the occasion, I beat up on a taunting target dummy. It was not satisfying at all, and left me with a bad taste in my mouth.

Esteban Cuevas Staff Alumnus

01/21/2012 at 07:25 PM

I adored the arcades. That's what I really miss from my childhood. The dark rooms, the loud arcades, the impressive graphics (I still love them to this day). That's why I'm such a big fighting game fan to this day.

Julian, you hurt my heart when you compared Asura's Wrath to something Sega would make. How dare you sulley the good name of Sega!

I miss instruction manuals but only when they're worth it. If developers are going to only make 11 page manuals, skip the booklet entirely and just put something in the game.

I do try to be as green as possible so maybe a legitimate manual in the game would be great. Make a cool 30 page manual and instead of printing it out, put it in the game and have a manual selection in the options menu. Hell, make them interactive. How about an awesome but cheesy voice over reading the back story?

Julian Titus Senior Editor

01/21/2012 at 08:39 PM

I didn't sully the good name of Sega, they have done a wonderful job of that on their own. But I don't understand your statement. My point was that Asura's Wrath doesn't seem to be going after the same prize as a God of War, Bayonetta, or Devil May Cry. It feels more like an arcade game: shallow, simple, and fun. Like I said in the podcast, there's a bit of Virtual On, a little Panzer Dragoon, some Dynamite Cop, and elements of Capcom's own Power Stone. You can gush about all of those games (and I do), but if you claim that they are deep experiences you have a screw loose.

On-disc manuals are an okay comprimise, but I'd much rather have a full-color, meaningful book. But since I'm one of the only people that ever read those things, I understand the reason for scrapping them. MGS HD Collection has the original booklets in digital form, but you can't refer back to them once you launch the game, defeating the purpose of it.

On the green subject, let's all be real for a second. None of the video game publishers scaled down their instruction booklets out of some concern for the environment. They did so to save money, plain and simple. Same thing with eco boxes. You pay the same price for a game, even though the printing cost to the publisher is way less. They make more money and come off looking like they are helping the planet, and the consumer gets shafted.

Nick DiMola Director

01/21/2012 at 09:32 PM

Amen to that. Eff the eco boxes, they are only benefitting the publishers.

Esteban Cuevas Staff Alumnus

01/21/2012 at 09:11 PM

I'm not saying that Sega created deep experiences. Panzer Dragoon is not like that. I should clarify that you've sully the good name of Sega back when it had a good name. I believe Asura's Wrath, judging by the demo, is below those titles. Outrun maybe be shallow like Kim Kardashian but Asura's Wrath is just a picture of Kim Kardashian.

Oh and I didn't get any other those comparisons when playing the demo. What came to mind is Dragon Ball Z (which I don't care for) and bad Emo music. Also, I disagree with the action beat-em-up comparisons. I think that's exactly the market they're going for and with all the crazy stuff going on and impressive graphics (the Street Fighter IV look BTW), I think this game must've had a pretty decent budget.

On game manuals should be accessible at all times. Pause the game, go to options and it should be there. That should be required too. Also, you're right about the publishers. They don't do this to help the environment but to save money. But hey, whatever works. Just don't go to those digipak cases. Those don't protect shit.

Julian Titus Senior Editor

01/21/2012 at 09:44 PM

I know that we played a different game, based on your comments on episode 49. Dragon Ball Z, absolutely. I'm a big fan, and Asura's Wrath feels like the Tenkaichi Budokai games (which, again, are shallow but fun games). Bad emo music? Since when is classical music emo? The soundtrack during the moon battle is epic in the way that classic anime was, and recalls the fight scene from Evangelion episode 9 (Dance Like You Want to Win!).

I really don't think that this is a character action game like the ones I mentioned. I could be wrong, but the emphasis on the cinematic battles and the lock-on style shooting makes it feel different than those. They may be going for that market, but that's a different argument. The game doesn't feel as tight as those games, and I don't think it's intended to. It's very much style over substance, but I'm cool with that.

I find it interesting that I can totally understand why you don't like it, but you don't seem to understand why I like it.

Oh, and you evade with RB. Says so right on the screen.

Esteban Cuevas Staff Alumnus

01/22/2012 at 11:43 AM

The music isn't my problem, although the classical music is a strange pick. The tone of the game and the presentation is like bad emo music: turned up to 11 and so overly dramatic that it ends up just being noise.

If you enjoy the game (demo really), then that's great. I don't want to deprive you of enjoyment of a title or anything for that matter. I never thought this title would be as bad as I found it to be. The main problem I have with this game is that with all the QTEs, it doesn't play like a game. Even when you're doing on rail events or normal gameplay, it's only to get to the next QTE or cutscene. Asura's Wrath would've been a great movie. Please explain to me what you like in this title in terms of gameplay. Not cutscenes you have little control over. The actual gameplay.

Oh and dodging on RB isn't said in gameplay. When enemies attack, the A button flashes quickly to avoid the attack.

Julian Titus Senior Editor

01/22/2012 at 01:29 PM

I like the variety of the gameplay, based on what was in the demo (which I have admitted is not a good demo). Instead of just melee, you're doing shooting, dodging, and yes, QTEs. You can't discount them as gameplay because you don't like them: you're still inputting commands to make your character do something. The melee feels good but shallow, again, more like an arcade game and less like a character action game.

I played the demo for the third time last night to see if my feelings had changed, and they haven't. In fact, the second episode was even more fun, because I had a better handle on the controls. Dashing out of the way of attacks, punching the hell out of Augus, firing up my Burst Mode for a brutal attack. It all plays for me. Did you know that Asura has a super mode with LT? I didn't, but I used it last night and it was really cool.Now, the controls aren't as tight as games like God of War, but again, I don't think that's what they're going for. With the heavy anime emphasis, the game feels more like the DBZ and Naruto fighting games, which traded tight, deep mechanics for spectacle. And as a hardcore fighting game fan I realize that those games aren't great, but they are still fun.

Could the game end up sucking? Sure. If 100% of the game is like the demo, I'm going to be disappointed. But I liked what I played in the demo, so I'll still enjoy it. I see Asura's Wrath as something that I buy, finish in a week, and put on the shelf, only bringing it back down to show friends how insane it is.

The A button is used to jump out of the way of certain attacks (like the fireballs in the first episode), to initiate certain QTEs, and to tech out of certain attacks (in the Augus fight). I'll give you that the game doesn't tell you the controls in game, but it does tell you what you need to know before the episodes load, as well as in the pause menu. But I also read instruction booklets, so I'm probably an odd duck when it comes to that. I'm sure the final game has a lengthy, hand holding tutorial.

Esteban Cuevas Staff Alumnus

01/23/2012 at 11:23 AM

All I have to go by is this demo and if this is what Capcom is sending out to represent their game, yikes. I'm not sure if this is the case for you but if you admit this demo isn't great and you haven't played the game in any other capasity, when you say you enjoy it, what are you going by?

I read instruction manuals too but this is a demo. No manuals. So I didn't know about RB dodge. Oh and yes, I did know there was a super mode with LT. It's the only way to really make an impact on the boss in Chapter 11. The burst attack is really just a cutscene. With both bosses, your attacks don't hurt him really. You're just filling up your burst meter which justs triggers a cutscene.

I guess we'll just have to agree to disagree because what you described as what you liked about the game, such as the melee feeling good and variety in the gameplay, I disagree. I don't think the melee feels good, and I don't think it's varied.

Again, I didn't think this game would be bad. I thought, "Hey, God of War rip off? I'm cool with that." I enjoyed Darksiders. The fact that Asura doesn't have a weapon means you'll have to get up close to hit enemies like old school beat-em-ups like Streets of Rage. I really said to myself "I don't like this game" with the boss fight on the moon. I finally got to control Asura and the controls were sluggish and lack impact. I know you think they aren't going for the God of War crowd but I assure you they are and even if they weren't, I don't like whatever it is it's trying to be.

Julian Titus Senior Editor

01/23/2012 at 09:34 PM

I already answered what I like in my previous comment.

When I say it's a bad demo, what I mean is that it's cut poorly. I've seen footage of the first part of the Episode 5 battle. You get to fight a bunch of grunts, as well as the boss in a more human size. Starting a demo off with QTEs isn't a great way to start off, even if the QTEs are handled well, and I think they are here.

If you're saying that the AW developers are going for the God of War fans, sure. I agree with you on that. But that's not what I've been saying. You assure me that they're going for a God of War style? How? Did you read that in an interview? I'm not saying that I know what they are going for-I'm basing my opinion on my experience with the game. The fact that Asura's Wrath has not one, but two buttons for projectiles, and one button for melee (on the B button, no less) leads me to believe that they are going for a different style of game. There's no upgrade mechanic shown or even hinted at in the demo, which again leads me to the arcade game comparison. I'll agree with you that the melee moves lack impact compared to those bigger action games, but sluggish? My biggest complaint in that second section was that Asura moved too fast.

I'm not even that passionate about this game. I had fun with it, and I want to play the finished product. But you act like it's the worst action game you've ever played. Put this game up against Splatterhouse (another arcadey action game, but more like God of War than this), and Asura's Wrath comes out looking pretty good. Plus, it's different, and that goes a long way with me.

Esteban Cuevas Staff Alumnus

01/23/2012 at 10:22 PM

I saw that too, with the grunts. That's why I was glad during Chapter 11 when I got control of Asura. Too bad I didn't like the way Asura controlled. The two buttons for projectiles and making B / O the melee attacks doesn't tell me they're going for a different style of gameplay. It tells me I need to adjust to the controls for really no reason. Also, since Asura's melee attacks aren't like Kratos which have a long range, the developers may be trying to make the projectiles the dominant attack as compensation.

I'm not saying that I read or saw in an interview the developers say they are going for the God of War fanbase but that's not a fair source. Most developers will say their game is something brand new and innovative even when it clearly isn't. Honestly, I wasn't that passionate about this game either but clearly we both are without us realizing it. I haven't played Splatterhouse but I wanted to try that one out too, until I heard it was terrible and I saw some gameplay footage. Which brings up the question why are you trying to support Asura's Wrath by comparing it to an awful game?

Julian Titus Senior Editor

01/23/2012 at 10:36 PM

I own Splatterhouse. It's not awful, it's just middle of the road, which is what I expect Asura's Wrath to be. I like it's style and character designs, which is enough to get me interested. As I've said, I predict that most people will hate AW, but it combines enough elements that could make it something special for me.

Let's be honest: this game is going to sell around 200,000 units between PS3 and 360. The only reason I estimate that high a number is because it's a Capcom game, and the graphics are amazing. It'll come out, I'll applaud it for trying to be different, and no one will care.

Esteban Cuevas Staff Alumnus

01/24/2012 at 12:45 AM

Honestly, the gameplay I saw of Splatterhouse didn't seem to be as bad as that game was being reviewed but it didn't give me a reason to want to play it. Maybe I'll try it out anyway.

I don't think Asura's Wrath is doing anything different at all but here's a scenario I hope will happen. It'll be bashed and be one of the biggest disappointments this year critically but it will sell well due to the reasons you mentioned. This will give Capcom a reason to do a sequel and an opportunity to make a better game.

Tighter controls, giving the player more control over the various gameplay modes, and new gameplay mechanics. How about Asura having Dhalsim arms? Replace one of the shooting buttons with a special attack button that uses a special attack meter? The special attacks can range from a Psycho Crusher like attack that crushes anyone in its path or a fury like attack in the vein of Dragon Ball Z (one aspect I like) that takes out a group of enemies or deals a lot of damage to one enemy.

For what it's worth, I may not like the game. At all. But I am offering ideas.

Nick DiMola Director

01/24/2012 at 08:16 AM

The fact that Asura's Wrath is not like God of War is exciting me. I need to play this demo now. Can't stand God of War and I can't stand that so many companies use that as the mold for making an action game. AW sounds a bit out there from the descriptions, but I typically like weird games that everyone else hates. Now on the other hand the anime comparisons are slightly dissuading me, but I suppose it could work. Anyway, I'll say it again - I really need to download this demo.

Julian Titus Senior Editor

01/24/2012 at 09:03 AM

Nick, knowing your stance on QTEs, I think you're going to hate it. But it's definitely a game that doesn't fit well into your typical action molds.

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